"Knuckling" toes

[superchauffer]

My dd likes to stand on the knuckles of her toes and says it feels good to stretch the tops of her feet that way. She has nicely arched feet and strong ankles, but watching this makes me cringe. Is this a common stretch and could it potentially be damaging?

[Victoria Leigh]

NOT a good idea! Standing on the knuckles does nothing to stretch the feet, and can definitely be damaging. Have her teacher tell her not to do that, as she will listen to that probably better than she will to you.

[superchauffer]

Aha! Just as I figured. I'll show her your reply and that should do the trick.

 

Thanks Ms. Leigh~

[cowgrrl]

My DD does this at her school under the teachers supervision. They stand at the barre for about 2 minutes & do this holding on. I may talk to her teacher but I don't know that anything would change.

[Victoria Leigh]

I don't understand the point of doing it. Sorry, but it makes no sense to me at all.

[cowgrrl]

Coming from a non-ballet background, my thought process was that it helped get the feet use to the pointe position. I've observed the class a few times through a door with a window & they seem to do this stretch(?) after they've warmed up at the barre but before they begin technique at the barre. As I said, it seems that they do it for about 2 minutes.

 

I will see her teacher in a few days & I may ask her how this is suppose to help her dancing.

[Victoria Leigh]

The toes are not supposed to be knuckled in the pointe position.

[cowgrrl]

I do know that. I was thinking more of the flex of the foot in pointe. When I, as a person with a non-ballet background, think of a foot in pointe, I think of a foot in which the top of the foot is stretched. Not painfully stretched, just muscles & tendons working. When I stand on the ###### of my feet & my toes(not knuckled under), I don't feel a stretch in the top of my foot. I stand on the ###### of my feet/toes a lot while bellydancing so it is something I'm use to. I feel dancing on my toes more in my calves than the top of my feet. But when I knuckle my toes under, I feel a stretch on the top of my foot.

 

But, as I've said, I don't know a lot about ballet, hence my being a member of this board (although it intimidates me at times!).

[Victoria Leigh]

Okay, there is a way to stretch the feet where you stand parallel and place one foot crossed over the other. The crossed foot is fully pointed, and you bend your standing knee and press it forward, pushing the pointed foot over. This COULD be the stretch you are talking about. If so, the toes are not knuckled, as the foot is pushed beyond that point. When the toes are knuckled, there is no stretch in the instep at all. So, it could be a matter of verbiage here, and a misconception of knuckling.

[cowgrrl]

First, Ms. Leigh, thanks for the input so far. I really appreciate it.

 

OK, not trying to beat a dead horse but trying to see if we're talking about the same thing & if this is something I should be concerned about. Here's what I see/what DD has shown me:

 

She curls her toes & then stands on her toe knuckles at the barre, holding on to the barre the entire time. Her body, including her legs, is straight. None of the girls appear to be forcing an arch into their feet but just standing in that position, balancing.

 

One of the moms 'snooping' with me commented 'I took ballet as a child & we never did that!'.

[Victoria Leigh]

Yes, I would be concerned about that. What you describe is not at all what I meant, and it really IS knuckling, and that is not a good thing. I can see no benefit whatsoever in doing ANYTHING in that position.

[Clara 76]

Can you say, "metatarsal fractures???" Seriously, if they are placing all of their body weight (save what is being placed into the barre- also not good) on their knuckles they are placing themselves at serious risk for fractures. Those bones are not meant to support weight like that.

 

Not that any of our bones are necessarily 'meant' for pointe, but when the proper training is there as a basis, it is fine to go en demi pointe and up to pointe- but knuckling has no place what-so-ever in classical ballet. Or contemporary ballet, for that matter. Or anything labeled ballet.

[gerlonda]

I'm from the adult board, am I suppose to say "knock, knock"? If I'm not suppose to be on here please remove my post.

Okay, I had a male ballet teacher that, in soft jazz shoes, would rise to the very tips of his toes while holding on to the barre when demonstrating for pointe classes. I've seen students (adults and children) actually "hop" to the tips of their toes in soft shoes in first position, and I think they also do this in the video "Basic Principles of Pointe" while at the barre in soft shoes. I for one can't do that.

Has anyone else seen people do that?

[Tuesday]

Other than Michael Jackson, certain Russian character dancers, and a handful of little kids, no, Gerlonda, I have not seen too many people hopping to the tips of their toes. I've never seen it in a ballet studio. Apparently it happens, though.

[Victoria Leigh]

Gerlonda, yes, this is a parents forum, so students are really not supposed to post. Also, we are not talking about tips of toes, we are talking about knuckling here. So, you are too. I did not remove it, as there was a response following which relates to it.