9 too young for pointe?

[Guest fadkison]

My daughter is scheduled to begin pointe class this fall. I am concerned she is too young. It was my understanding that pointe training began at age 11 or 12.

 

She has taken ballet since she was 3. She was advanced 2 levels a couple years ago, so the girls in her class are 1 and 2 years older than her. Last year she had 1 hour of "pre" pointe and 1 hour of technique each week.

 

I have heard starting pointe too young can cause long term foot problems. Can anyone help me gain a better understanding of what is required to progress to pointe? Thanks!

[K8smom]

Welcome to Ballet Talk for Dancers, fadkison. Here's something to read before one of our teacher mods responds: Facts about pointework

[taoofpooh]

The girls at the school my kids dance require them to see a podiatrist who assesses their physical readiness for pointe. My DD did this two years ago at age 11. The podiatrist they recommend was a dancer herself. The assessment included x-rays as well as an assessment that looked at technique and muscle development. My DD had two follow up appointments with homework. She was to practice in class things like turnout all the way from ankles to hips and keeping her turnout in echappes and second demipointe. Then after pointe had started we had another appointment to see her sur la pointe about 3 months later.

Edited August 7, 2006 by taoofpooh

[blochbuyer]

I think you should go with ypur gut feeling on this one. Everyone knows someone who went on pointe young but I'd say most are 11. There are pluses to waiting as your daughter will be much stronger in 2 years time and more co-ordinated(I'm not saying she isn't now). I saw this in my own daughter who did grade 4 for two years and by the end of the second year it was visible how much stronger and steadier she was and she started the long process of beginning pointe 6 months later. She also had to be checked out by a dance physio prior to starting pointe and had rigourous homework before being allowed to get those pointe shoes. I realise in your country your daughter is probably doing more hours of dance a week than is the norm here, and therefore may be stronger in technique than what we would expect from a girl that age but physiologically she is still a little girl. Read all the info on this site, get your daughter checked out independently by a specialist and if you decide she is too young then there are plenty of people here who have gone through the same situation.

[Victoria Leigh]

fadkison, I am very much against a 9 year old being put on pointe, for all the reasons stated in the article I wrote a long time ago, which is linked for you in K8's post above. They don't even start them that early in Russia, where they have daily technique classes. Unless your daughter is in a school with a very professional teacher, and she is one of those rare exceptions who has ballet technique classes daily, and she is physically and technically exceptionally mature for that age, I could not accept the idea of placing her on pointe. In addition to the potential physical damage in later years, it is quite unlikely that she has the technical requirements for pointe work.

 

Out of curiosity, how many ballet classes a week does she take, how long are the classes, and does she study in the summer? The number of years she has been taking are irrelevant prior to the age of at least 7, since the early years are creative movement and pre-ballet. What has her schedule been like the last two years? How many levels are there in the school and what level is she in now?

[Guest fadkison]

Victoria I have read your article and found it very helpful. I had not realized all that was required to begin pointe work. This will be helpful to me when I meet with my daughter's school. I plan to request she add another hour of ballet this year for a total of 3 hours per week. I want to wait before starting pointe at least another year.

 

To answer your question. My daughter has taken 2 (1 hour) ballet classes per week, including the summer, for the past 2 years. Her school has 3 divisions. There are multiple levels in each division. She is in the 1st division, the levels are broken out by age. My daughter was moved up 2 age levels when she was 7. Beginning pointe is the last level before moving to the 2nd division. The 2nd division requires an "audition" and the levels are based on skill. The 3rd division is considered pre professional.

 

Thanks for all the posts. This site has been extremely helpful to me.

[Victoria Leigh]

fadkison, she is not receiving enough training to be ready for pointe. One hour classes at the pre-pointe level are not sufficient. She should have a minimum of 3 one hour and a half classes for at least a year before beginning pointe. That, combined with her age, are two huge reasons not to be even thinking about pointe shoes yet. What I might think about would be a different school.

[CDR]

Hi I'm listed as a teacher on this site but my daughter dances too so am I allowed to post here?

 

Anyway, it seems the age considered appropriate for pointework in the USA is 12, it isn't the case in England though. 10 is considered to be perfectly acceptable here and some teachers put their students on at 9 if they're capable. The RAD's Intermediate Foundation exam can be taken from the age of 11 so children need to start pointework at 10 if they want to take this exam at this age. I generally wait until a student is 11 but I have done it a few months earlier in the past if I felt it was justified.

 

I don't want to go against the opinion of experts in the USA, I just want to point out that it isn't necessarily the opinion in other parts of the world. Do what you feel is right and if you think it's wrong, don't risk it.

[Victoria Leigh]

CDR, do the children who go on pointe at 9 or 10 have the amount of training they should have to work on pointe, even assuming they are physically mature enough? It seems to me that what I have heard about the RAD programs in Great Britain is that they have 2 classes a week in the lower levels. Is this correct? I just don't know know anyone could be ready for pointe work at that age with that little bit of training. Can you tell us a bit more about their program?

[Fiz]

Miss Leigh, some schools in the UK may do that, but at my daughter's last school, they are not put on pointe till 13. My daughter was 14. My daughter is doing interfoundation, and there are many children who are pre- teen and although they can technically do the exam at 11, I do not know of any (out of two reputable schools) who have allowed this. Fiz. xxx

[CDR]

CDR, do the children who go on pointe at 9 or 10 have the amount of training they should have to work on pointe, even assuming they are physically mature enough? It seems to me that what I have heard about the RAD programs in Great Britain is that they have 2 classes a week in the lower levels. Is this correct? I just don't know know anyone could be ready for pointe work at that age with that little bit of training. Can you tell us a bit more about their program?

 

All schools are different as it depends on the teacher. Like I said I generally wait until a student is 11 years old. I insist that a student has attended 2 classes a week (1 hour per class usually) for at least 6 months although most will have done 2 or more classes for a few years. I recommend 2 classes a week from Grade 1, very strongly advise it from Grade 3 and if a student is old enough, strong enough etc etc when they're in Grade 4 or 5 they can start basic pointework in a sepearate pointe class (having done it on the demi-pointe for a month or so beforehand), they move away from the barre after about 6 months usually but we do still take things slowly unless a student is very strong and very capable.

 

This does seem to be very different to the USA but I really do think it's the norm in the UK, any other British teachers out there care to comment?

 

A student attending only 1 class a week would never be put onto pointe (in my school at least) and we do have students who can't commit to more than 1 class per week, usually for financial reasons. There seems to be far less committment from students in England than in the USA, this is evident just from reading posts on this website. Even during my teacher training there was very little guidance given about pointework, perhaps it's something the RAD should address considering the differences between the two countries.

 

p.s. I often send my students on courses and if I ever send a 13 or 14 year old on an intermediate foundation course they are always the oldest in the class with children as young as 9 attending and dancing on pointe, most are 10 or 11.

Edited August 9, 2006 by CDR

[G2B4]

"My daughter is doing interfoundation, and there are many children who are pre- teen and although they can technically do the exam at 11, I do not know of any (out of two reputable schools) who have allowed this. Fiz."

 

But in Canada we certainly do this, and use two reasons: the RAD exam schedule, and the age at which they are accepted into the residential schools and put on pointe. (Which the teachers want them to do well at during their summer audition, so some of them put them up even earlier.) I'm a little confused by the inter. foundation minimum age ... I thought the minimum age for intermediate was 11? Is intermediate foundation the same age? I know a girl who did her advanced one at 12 but needed special permission so I thought the majors exams were set out in two year intervals, like so : intermediate - 11, advanced 1 - 13, advanced 2 - 15, solo seal 17. Are these the recommended ages? Because if you started learning your intermediate at 9 (taking the recommended two years), that would be when you went on pointe ... not counting intermediate foundation.

 

CDR, I was told that intermediate foundation was only for little ones and 13 or 14 was too old to take it, they should do intermediate instead. Comments?

[CDR]

Glad to hear we're not the only country putting children on pointe at this age!

 

Just checked the RAD's website. The ages are as follows:

 

Intermediate Foundation - minimum age 11

Intermediate - 12

Advanced Foundation - 13

Advanced 1 - 14

Advanced 2 - 15

Solo Seal - No age specified but must hold Advanced 2 with Distinction

 

You can take exams from Intermediate a year younger than the ages specified if you got Distinction for the previous exam.

 

p.s. going to bed now as it's midnight here!

Edited August 9, 2006 by CDR

[G2B4]

CDR, have they made recent changes? I have never heard of advanced foundation (sounds rather oxymoron-ish, doesn't it?!) and I have known a number of kids younger than recommended who I don't think all got distinction (from rec. schools). Also ones even younger. Perhaps these ages are guidelines and there are exceptions?

 

PS. Sorry, good night!!

[Mel Johnson]

Advanced Foundation is the old Intermediate with a new coat of paint. The change came a few years ago.