Terminology question/name this (basic) step

[Merry]

It's taken me a whole year to work out why I didn't recognise the term 'battement glissé', but did remember the step. It's just come to me that I knew it as 'battement jeté'. I looked up battement jeté in an online ballet dictionary and that told me the same movement could also be called a battement dégagé.

 

I thought I remembered something I knew as a dégagé, but not a battement dégagé, but I don't know if my mind is playing tricks (remember I'm thinking back several decades!). I haven't been able to find a reference to dégagé without it meaning a battement dégagé. I find it really difficult to explain in words, but very basically the step I think I remember was like a miniture développé, but the extending foot went down to the floor as the leg stretched - this done with a fondu of the supporting leg, both legs straightening together.

 

I need to know what the above should be called if it isn't a dégagé! I can't wait until I see my teacher again as class has finished until after the New Year and I can't be thinking about this all over Christmas - I may go mad!!

[Victoria Leigh]

Dégagé is just short for battement dégagé, same as tendu is really battement tendu. The step you describe sounds like a pas de cheval.

[Merry]

Pas de cheval

 

That's it!!!! lol

 

I've just had a major flashback - my teacher sitting on her dining chair (from which she always taught) talking about prancing horses and managing to demonstrate said step whilst still sitting down and wearing street shoes, yet the demonstations always seemed to work. I don't know how I came to get dégagé and pas de cheval mixed up, particularly as they neither sound or look the same, and we called a battement dégagé a 'battement jeté in any case! I think I need a lie down now!!!

 

Thank you so much Ms Leigh for your patience with me

 

I can see I need to get some books on the subject.

[Victoria Leigh]

That's why we're here, Merry!

[moreilly]

I've just had a major flashback - my teacher sitting on her dining chair (from which she always taught) talking about prancing horses and managing to demonstrate said step whilst still sitting down and wearing street shoes, yet the demonstations always seemed to work.

 

Isn't it funny how it works like that?? I have a teacher who demonstrates in bulky, black postal shoes and what she refers to as "marking" and it's still more beautiful than anything I can produce!

[Skittl1321]

While we are on pas de cheval, what is the name of the opposite step (where you go out with a straight leg and come back in with the bending motion)? We always do them at the same time, and I can never remember what they are called.

[Hans]

It could be battement enveloppé, battement retiré, or battement raccourci.

[Skittl1321]

Enveloppe is what I was thinking of! Thank you.

[Mel Johnson]

It can also be battement fouetté. Also, remember that dégagé can be simply the adjectival sense of the past participle simply meaning, "disengaged", usually from a closed position to an open one.

[Mazenderan]

Enveloppe is what I was thinking of! Thank you.

 

I love those! They feel so dainty and precise!

[Skittl1321]

I like pas de cheval much more than enveloppe. I can't control my foot as well in enveloppe, and tend to get weird sickle or flexed positions.

 

I don't really understand why, as it seems like the movement should be the same. Pas de cheval is fun, but if the class is feeling hyper it ends up with a lot of whinnying as the kids pretend to be horses before we start.

[Merry]

Pas de cheval is fun, but if the class is feeling hyper it ends up with a lot of whinnying as the kids pretend to be horses before we start.

 

If my teacher years ago had been the sort to allow such behaviour then I might have remembered the name of the step!

[Skittl1321]

Yes- I think that was the idea. It really did help the girls remember.

 

But now that they are older, it kind of needs to stop

[Chinafish]

Merry, from the RAD "Foundations of Classical Ballet Technique" and "Progressions of Classical Ballet Technique" books:

 

Battement Glissé is "the opening and closing of the fully stretched working leg with a quick gliding action of the foot which causes the toes to be released just off the floor. It is a movement to develop speed of footwork."

 

Battement Jeté is "a sharply thrown action of the working leg opening to 45 degrees and returning strongly to a closed position. The movement is used for developing strength and turnout, and is important in the preparation of allegro steps."

 

The way that I was taught and how it's been set by my teachers, is that glissés are usually quicker and the jetés usually are slower. Jetés usually have more of an "out" feeling too.

 

The RAD uses the term "dégagé" in the syllabus but generally means the working leg opening devant, a la seconde or derriere from a closed position, so disengaging from a closed position, instead of referring to (what some of my other teachers who do not teach RAD) disengaging the toes from the floor.

 

As for the enveloppé, the RAD puts that into the Adage section of bring a leg from devant, a la seconde or derriere position en l'air into retiré. Or as Battement frappé fouetté as "an inward whipping action of the lower leg. Commencing with the leg extended to 2nd at 45 degrees, and maintaining height, turnout and control of the thigh, the working knee bends so that the foot is brought sharply into contact with the supporting leg either devant or derriere." So dynamic wise RAD doesn't actually have an equivalent of the dainty fast enveloppé.

 

And the Battement fouetté is another animal: "A whipping action of the working leg at 45 degrees tracing a 90-degree arc. [...] From 5th position the leg executes a battement to 4th position devant en l'air at 45 degrees and, retaining its height, makes a fouetté to 2nd position. The movement may be taken en dehors from 4th position devant or 2nd position, or en dedans from 4th position derriere or 2nd position and may also be taken at 90 degrees." In this definition the knees do not bend at all!

 

I find it so interesting that different schools have different terminologies, referring to same steps with different names and sometimes different steps with same names. Didn't we all develop from the same roots??

[Mel Johnson]

I find it so interesting that different schools have different terminologies, referring to same steps with different names and sometimes different steps with same names. Didn't we all develop from the same roots??

 

Did you ever play the game "telephone" when you were a child?